Advice for young impressionable women
Let me tell you this, young ladies, you with the frizzy hair, or the bad skin, or the larger-than-fashion-pages bottom:
At some point, some suave sounding man is going to come up to you and make you feel like he’s the only one that understands. He’ll do it in one sentence, and you, possibly, will want to melt into his arms.
Let me clarify, young women. The sweetness he whispers is not succour, but poison.
You will be sitting, eyes cast down perhaps, feeling a little sorry for yourself, and he will approach you, and say, in a low growl; ‘No one understands you like I do’, or ‘How beautiful you are - if you could but see it!’
Slowly, he will turn this around, until it becomes (and I’ve heard this so many times that I begin to think I must have a hat with “I HAVE NO CONFIDENCE” written on it”) - “You don’t know how beautiful you are - I understand you, no one else does. You must shun those people who say you are not attractive - I say you are attractive, listen to me say it, over, and over, and over again. Trust. Me……”
And then he turns into a snake. And then he does NASTY SNAKE THINGS.
Let me explain. There is a certain kind of man in the world that slithers around, looking for an underconfident young woman. When he finds her, he slithers in, and nestles beside her, and does everything he can to both bolster her low-confidence (by telling her that other people must think she is unattractive)(”You mustn’t worry about people thinking you’re ugly”), while simultaniously raising his own profile (by telling her that he’s the one in a million that actually DOES find her attractive)(”I don’t care about what society says is beautiful - I think you’re amazing”).
By this end - and I know, yes, that there are many many men who actually *don’t* care what society thinks is beauty, I’m not talking about you here, I’m tlaking about those nasty abusive men who want someone to feel *very little* and beholden to them - and by the end of the conversation, the aim is that the slightly sorry and impressionable young woman will feel less about herself, but more about herself when in the presence of this ‘complimenting’ man. She will bend over backwards for him. She will bend over for him. She will be silly for him.
Let me give you an example. Being me, and pretty, but chubby, and always chubby in some way shape or form, I have met many many many of these men.
They come over and expect you to sleep with them just for talking to you.
And they’re not chatting you up because they think you’re attractive.
No, it’s because they know they’re too unattractive to do any better.
So they pick someone attractive but weak. Or just weak. And then they home in.
Last weekend, we were in Belgium, and in a very very lovely bar where, over the course of the evening, everyone started talking to one another. Beer followed beer, and the conversation became bigger, and, toward the end of the evening, I noticed one man kept trying to talk to me every time my beloved went to the bar, or toilet, or talked to anyone else.
Eventually, he made his swoop…
“You know, you shouldn’t listen to people when they say you’re unattractive… I think you’re gorgeous… Really sexy… I noticed you earlier… I think you’re just beautiful, all of you…. you shouldn’t care what other people say….”
And you know what the funny thing is? At the time, I just said “Oh, well, thanks”, and turned around and talked to anyone else as quickly as I could. But the more I’ve thought about it this week, the more annoyed I’ve got, and the more the only possible riposte has formed in my head.
“You know” he said, “You shouldn’t listen to people when they say you’re unattractive”
“You know?” I should have said, but didn’t, “The funny thing is, they don’t. They don’t say that. Ever.
“I don’t have to listen to them say I’m unattractive, because no one Does say I’m unattractive. You know why that is? Because I’m Not. Or if I am, they’re polite enough not to bring it up in some twisted ‘I’ll take advantage of you later’ kind of chat-up line.
“And, also, I’m not. So there.”
Later, he tried to get us back to his flat, and my beloved fell over a table, just to preserve my honour.
But, seriously, and thinking back on it, I know this is the kind of man to be afraid of. The one that picks on your insecurities to flatter you and beat you down at the same time. The one who forces himself into the position of the knight in shing armour by telling you you’re ugly and making you grateful for it.
There are lots of them. Honestly. I am away from them now, being tucked up in my enormous IKEA bed of smugness with my wonderful beloved. But I was reminded of them last week by this horrible, horrible specimen.
And if I could do anything - *anything* - to stop the me and my friends of ten years ago from actually listening to these slimeballs for up to ten years, then I would.
So if me ten years ago is reading:
Don’t.
Because you know what? No one does. And you aren’t. And you shouldn’t. Because … and here’s the thing it’s going to take you at least ten years to realise… You’re actually lovely. So there.
And that’s my advice for impressionable young women.
Well, that and the theoretical avoidance of mooncups
(see comment box on post below…)
Wise words, Anna. Would you have listened ten years ago, though?
Comment by Em² — 12 July, 2005 12:36 am
*Ping*
That was that last post striking a chord. Very well put.
Unfortunately I think only the wisdom of age enables the nasty snake men to be spotted and get the much deserved punishment of being repeatedly poked with a pointy stick.
Comment by abi — 12 July, 2005 1:18 am
I know it’s too late for this (as many of the best retorts usually are…) but you should have zinged back with, “And *you* shouldn’t listen to people who call you an asshole. You’re quite clearly a prick.”
Frennz
Comment by Frennzy — 12 July, 2005 1:44 am
beautifully written. i only wish i had ignored the snakes of my past.
Comment by liliana — 12 July, 2005 1:54 am
I have had many comments of the same ilk. I was told that I was individual looking or unconventionally pretty. One man went so far as to call me exotic. That one was purely ridiculous, because I look like the round-faced daughter of Russian Mennonite peasants. I am the pretty round-faced daughter of Russian Mennonite peasants, but still. Thank god I only ended up going to dinner with him.
Comment by schmutzie — 12 July, 2005 2:36 am
Well put. Another clue to help tell whether he’s sincerely complimenting you or going for the manipulation: He flatters your worst feature. They know that you know your nose is crooked or your complexion is blotchy or your neck is stumpy, and they know that if you’re past high school, you’ve been teased about that feature. So they’ll compliment you outrageously on it, with the intention of leaving you saying, “… Wow. Really?? You mean that??” and then they’re in.
A guy in a bar complimented my complexion a few years ago, calling my face “smooth as porcelain.” I’m attractive, but I DO own a mirror and I KNOW what my skin looks like. Five years earlier, I’d have followed him to his hotel room like he asked, just to hear him praise my flawless complexion some more. Instead, I told him he needed to stop drinking because he was clearly in danger of losing his eyesight. I wish I’d learned that ten years prior though…
Comment by elayne — 12 July, 2005 4:36 am
A fair point. Unfortunately too many of my fellow blokes use that tactic… although I have to say, it’s not like women are above doing the same (I speak from experience, although I think I was always too jaded to believe the line).
In any case, having seen photos of you, Anna, I think it was a downright rude thing to say, because it’s plainly not the case anyway.
Comment by Fraz — 12 July, 2005 9:36 am
If you’ll forgive the slight off-topic drift (but hey, this ain’t gonna be no *mooncup*), this reminds me for some reason of the old Biff cartoon, showing two lovers embracing.
He: “Believe me Kate - as a feminist myself, I’m simply pointing out areas where lack of theory perhaps prevents you from perceiving the true nature of your oppression.”
She: “Will nobody rid me of this patronising smoothie”
Comment by mike — 12 July, 2005 9:47 am
I am going to shut up about it, really. I mean, I have shut up about it, although I really don’t see why we shouldn’t be allowed to…
OK, no, I’m not going to talk about it. Apart from…
“theoretical avoidance”
Eh?
Comment by Clare — 12 July, 2005 10:37 am
P.S. Absolutely about the snakes and the poking of them with sharp pointy objects, and generally SHOUTING AT THEM VERY LOUD and not letting them get away with the nasty behaviour. Yes. Spot on. I agree.
Comment by Clare — 12 July, 2005 10:39 am
Well, I can’t advocate absolute avoidance, because I’ve never actually tried them. I had *heard* of them before yesterday, but I think I blocked it out.
So as in theory I find the idea of them ooky, I would therefore in theory avoid them and that would be my theoretical advice, since I can’t actually give that as actual advice, because I’ve never tried them.
Now, if we’ve got to talk about mooncups at all, can we at least confine the conversation to it’s rightful and proper place - i.e a post about hairdryers?
Comment by anna — 12 July, 2005 11:08 am
[ponders on the concept of a hair-moon-dryer-cup]
[rings patenting office]
Comment by Clare — 12 July, 2005 11:24 am
Well on behalf of normal men I would like to apologise for the fact most of us are pigs. The amount of times I have had to hear a blokes go on “she’d be really stunning if she lost a few pounds”. No, actually, she’s pretty damn stunning right now. Sigh.
Although in fairness many women treat men just as badly. The amount of times I’ve seen (or been) a shy guy approach a girl to ask her something and been shot down in a nasty humilating way. Not saying this balances out, but girls can be snakes too.
In fact that’s half the problem. The nice guys get shot down by the snake girls. And the snake guys go for the nice girls. So there is this cross connection where nice guys and nice girls don’t meet cause all the snakes are ruining it for the rest of us.
It does amaze me how many times you see a guy being an complete twat and still manage to pick up the girl. I don’t know when drunk and annoying became endearing. Even worse when you see a girl with a complete knob who treats her like shit but she stays with him. Never understand it.
Comment by Adrian — 12 July, 2005 11:37 am
Surely the female equivalent, rather than simply being a bitchy woman, would be a woman who seeks out insecure men and then says such things as “Don’t listen to all those bitches who say you have a big nose. I think your nose is lovely,” and then proceeds to encourage the man to be dependent on her, leading to believe that she is his only ally in a hostile world, while simultaneously perpetuating his low self esteem?
I guess it must happen, because people of both genders are capable of most things. But I don’t think it’s as common.
Comment by Clare — 12 July, 2005 1:29 pm
Hmmm. Well said. My sister keeps on stumbling across these worthless specimens. And then restumbling across them after they’ve committed snakelike atrocities, and saying things like “But he’s being lovely at the moment”. Glutton for punishment. I no understand.
Comment by rachie — 12 July, 2005 1:30 pm
But I do think that both men and women are guilty of forming relationships where they have all the power and their partner is suppressed in some way. People who deal with their own issues by treating someone else badly. I think this is a crime committed by men, women, gay, straight, possibly in equal measures.
Just the specific thing of using insecurities about body image as a way of gaining power over somebody, or getting sex - possibly that’s done more by men to women than any other combination. Maybe.
Comment by Clare — 12 July, 2005 1:39 pm
I bet these men practise this schtick by belittling their own cocks before having a wank; and I bet they have much to belittle about.
(Pardon me if that’s lowering the tone. We can go back to mooncups.)
Comment by PB Curtis — 12 July, 2005 2:40 pm
Gosh, here am I trying to escape the clutches of a smooth talking snake and I stumble across your site. Great post, thank you.
Comment by Mia — 12 July, 2005 2:43 pm
*sigh*
well said, Anna. I wish I had read this post many years ago, too. In the end things worked out wonderfully for me, but it would have been nice to avoid all the snakes en route.
Comment by the other other Karen — 12 July, 2005 3:45 pm
The other problem is that the snake guy is shielding you from the genuine princes. So could I add an addendum to your advice. To those girls, you see the guy sitting quietly over there in the corner not saying much but keeping on glancing over in your direction surreptitiously? He’s the guy who actually *does* find you *devestatingly* attractive but is too shy to come over and tell you. Go over and talk to him.
Comment by Alan — 12 July, 2005 6:38 pm
Hear hear Alan. Which is what the movie Hitch (in a holywood fashion) tried to show. It’s so hard for the nice guy to get past all the snakes.
Comment by Adrian — 12 July, 2005 6:51 pm
As an impressionable young girl, I have nothing to say but thank you, thank you very muchos Anna. I’m sure I’ll forget it when the time comes, but thank yoo for trying to save me whilst you can.
Comment by Keight — 12 July, 2005 7:30 pm
Alan - amen - that is so true…
Comment by the other other Karen — 12 July, 2005 8:25 pm
This is the best, very best post I’ve read in a very long time. Outstanding. I had many a**holes do this to me, all of them over 10 years my senior. I think they do this purposefully so that they can control some young innocent, knowing full well, someone their own age, wouldn’t be caught dead with the likes of them.
Comment by Rowan79 — 12 July, 2005 9:31 pm
Duh…
What the hell is a ‘Mooncup’?
Have I missed out (again)?
Kind regards…
Comment by Glen Horne — 12 July, 2005 11:24 pm
Glen Glen Glen Glen.
The whole conversation is in the comment box on the post below. The one about hairdryers. As I said, in the old post there.
There are even links to the mooncup things.
Seriously, you don’t want to know, though.
Comment by anna — 13 July, 2005 11:11 am
Why “mooncup”? No, forget it, I don’t wish to know. Sorry.
Comment by Paul — 13 July, 2005 12:12 pm
My advice for young impressionable women is you’ll date bastards, be dumped by bastards, get preggers by a bastard (dumped again because of a fat tum) and fall into the caring arms of, yes you guessed it, another bastard so learn well and learn quicky my female friends.
Or you can get over the first bastard and become more choosy. Or a bitch. Avoid 18-30 holidays and men with mousers.
Choose life. Get a haircut. Start looking for a job. While you live under my roof you live by my rules.
Comment by Dear Marky — 13 July, 2005 12:23 pm
Afternoon, Mark dear.
Comment by anna — 13 July, 2005 12:35 pm
Sorry, can I point out that when my friends of old, my Bramhall Boys turned Manchester Men turn up, do they drop everything to point out that I am, in fact, loevly, and that any man that suggested I wasn’t would get punched in the face?
No, they don’t.
What a bunch of consumate gentlemen.
Sorry, I’m having to resist a string nostalgic temptation to write ‘NOT!’ after that sentence. Has it been long enough? Can we bring back ‘NOT!’ as a valid if somewhat postmodern phrase?
Because it would be cool, you see.
NOT!
Comment by anna — 13 July, 2005 12:42 pm
You know I’ve read Marky’s comment about 4 times and still can’t figure out if he is actually trying to be supportive or is just being misogynistic. Still can’t tell.
As for NOT!, I’ve been waiting years for this to be brought back so I can say it without being derided. (Not the absence of NOT! form that last sentence.)
Comment by Adrian — 13 July, 2005 12:48 pm
Adrian: You know me like a brother. NOT!
I’m a member of the WI don’t you know. Wish I taken off my bra when they asked me to burn it.
: ( #
Comment by Dear Marky — 13 July, 2005 2:06 pm
Adrian: You know me like a brother. NOT!
I’m a member of the WI don’t you know. Wish I had taken off my bra when they asked me to burn it.
: ( #
Comment by Dear Marky — 13 July, 2005 2:09 pm
Sevitz, do ignore mark, he;s a bit of a twat, and thinks he’s funny.
Also, he clearly doesn’t know how to use a comment box.
Just ignore him. Seriously.
He’s also ginger.
Comment by anna — 13 July, 2005 2:12 pm
There’s no need for abuse. Well really.
Comment by Dear Marky — 13 July, 2005 2:43 pm
“Sorry, can I point out that when my friends of old, my Bramhall Boys turned Manchester Men turn up, do they drop everything to point out that I am, in fact, loevly, and that any man that suggested I wasn’t would get punched in the face?
No, they don’t.
What a bunch of consumate gentlemen.”
?????????????????????????????????????????????????
So I can take it from this that your definition of a gentleman is to immediately compliment every woman that they meet? Has the world gone stark raving mad?!? Are we all that shallow?
Love from a beleaguered and needlessly persecuted man
Comment by Matt — 13 July, 2005 2:54 pm
Well you could have said something bloody nice.
Comment by anna — 13 July, 2005 2:58 pm
You have a lovely septum
Comment by Matt — 13 July, 2005 3:56 pm
Remind me what a septum is?
Comment by Clare — 13 July, 2005 5:11 pm
It’s the bridge between the nostrils.
Comment by anna — 13 July, 2005 5:16 pm
I mean, that’s what it actually *is*, whether that’s what he *meant* or not is an entirely different issue.
Comment by anna — 13 July, 2005 5:18 pm
Gorgeous post. How can you be so wise and yet so young? Took me till my fifties before it sank in that my “one great love” all those decades earlier was really one of your snake-men all along. So I read your post in a mood of, “Yes! That’s it! I know him! I’ve met him! I fell for him!”
Nowadays I’d really love to meet him on fire. And not piss on him.
And I’m becoming more and more inclined to think that “love” is really mental illness. Glorious post I say again. Really wish I’d read it in 1969. (Back in the summer.)
Comment by Peter — 14 July, 2005 10:20 am
I think romantic love is just a temporary delusion to ensure human procreation. Boring pedantic conclusion I know, but surprisingly liberating.
Comment by Paul — 14 July, 2005 11:43 am
I too know such men. For them scoundrels I apologise. However, there is one phrase that ladies are too fond of making which always makes my sugar-levels plummet: “I love a man with a sense of humour.” I mean, why not just put a bucket on my head and hit it with a stick?
Comment by wyndham — 14 July, 2005 11:46 am
Thanks for that, Wyndham. But I *do* love a man with a sense of humour. I also love women with a sense of humour. I may just love the sense of humour.
I also love the idea of hitting with a stick a bucket with someone’s head in it.
And Paul, of course that’s true - everyone thinks that, don’t they?
Comment by anna — 14 July, 2005 11:55 am
They do, Anna? Really?
I must take this bucket off my head and go investigate further.
Comment by Paul — 14 July, 2005 2:53 pm
So if you remove the procreative ability, are you delivered from the delusion? That would cast a whole new light on things.
Doctor: You are a slave, PB… You take nothing, the story ends, you awake in your bed and believe whatever you want to believe. You take the vasectomy, you stay in Wonderland, and I show you how deep the rabbit-hole goes.
I was wondering what she was talking about, and why she was wearing that swooshy coat.
Comment by PB Curtis — 14 July, 2005 3:02 pm